Yeah, that’s a funny conundrum. Of course it makes sense from a real-world perspective how the gods that are superheroes and the gods that are actively worshipped would be mutually exclusive categories — the alternative may not be *inherently* bad but it’s a delicate balancing act that most people would prefer to avoid — but from a diegetic perspective, of course it’d seem weird.
In a world where actual gods are walking around and everyone knows it the term atheist would probably changed to include “does not worship any god”, just like it was changed in our world to include “lacks belief in any god”. It just makes things easier.
Many people that would be Atheists in reality, would just go by Antitheists instead, particularly the kind that does believe in gods but not in their worship.
Pterry has indulged on this. The gods there sometimes form a mob and attack the houses of atheist. Also Susan Sto Helit’s ability while working as a teachers and caregiver to actually beat up figures like the bogeyman, are explained away as psychological tricks to help the children get over theirs fear of is supposedly purely imaginary threats.
“As the novels progress, Susan proves to be quite good at handling small children, a skill that is attributed to her sensible and practical nature. This is reflected in her novel approach to children’s problems. When a child complains about a monster in the cupboard or under the bed, most parents would go to great lengths to carefully explain to the child that there is no monster. Susan, on the other hand, simply hands the child a suitable weapon with which to assault the monster, or, in the event of an actual monster, assaults it herself. Monsters from a wide area have come to dread the fireplace poker she uses for this task, although as word of Susan has quickly spread among the city’s resident monsters, she lately has only needed to deal with newcomers.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_Sto_Helit
In The Dresden Files, there’s this group of paladins called the Knights of the Cross, who each carry a sword with a nail from the Crucifixion embedded in the hilt, in order to fight fallen angels.
Sanya, the only remaining active member of the three the series started with, is an agnostic.
Waldo Butters, the first permanent replacement Knight, is Jewish.
His attempts to sue the protagonist multiple times for damage done to his electronics shop have become laughable at best, as his whole case depends on finding a judge who believes magic is real. Which he can’t.
Brainier heroes like Reed Richards and Tony Stark are willing to acknowledge that things like gods and magic MIGHT be real… Of course, since they count Dr. Strange and Thor as close friends and allies, you get the idea that they’re just too stubborn to admit there’s a part of the world that even they can’t explain.
I like the Discworld interpretation (paraphrased) of that “Once you start peddling with the occult, you start believing in fairies, and then in gods.” “But all those things EXIST.” “That don’t mean you should believe in ‘em. It only encourages them.”
Yeah, but they wouldn’t consider a “superhero god” to be a “god”.
Just an empowered alien long lived being who their un-enlightened ancestors once worshiped as “god”. Many of the super beings in this setting would be considered “gods” in an un-enlightened time. It depends on you interpretation of “god”.
A bunch of the gods in question basically act like Asstronomus. They’ve got superhuman powers which they mostly just use to indulge their whims.
When you’re worshipping, you probably prefer gods that are a bit more transcendental. Or at least, you worship them for their less tangible, but more useful, ability to make the crops grow, or whatever is supposed to be their special sphere of influence.
Maybe not everyone can learn magic, but you only hear about people who managed it?
Shitropolis also explicitly has an unusually high density of superpowers. The advanced technology may be part of that, with science superheroes who can make things that don’t actually work if anyone else builds them, or who understand concepts that are literally beyond the grasp of an ordinary human brain.
Odin is still worshipped Keith, he just doesn’t have that many followers.
Tbh I thought the third panel would be focusing on there being atheists around, rather than the major worshipped gods not being present.
But nice to see that there wasn’t any Nay-theism or flat-eart atheism being flung around.
From a Doylist perspective, the truth is that these superhero universes are dictated by their writers, most of whom seek to specifically keep Marvel and DC, et al, as artificially close to ‘real life’ as possible.
Hence advanced tech that is still so limited, a lack of repeatable artificial power methods so superhuman arms races aren’t an issue, and such. And of course no Superhero Jesus lest you offend a large portion of your reader base or churches/synagogues/mosques start suing.
Our heroes already saw how scary Big Religion can be in court…
British science fiction writer Arthur C. Clarke formulated three adages that are known as Clarke’s three laws, of which the third law is the best known and most widely cited. They are part of his ideas in his extensive writings about the future. These so-called laws are:
1. When a distinguished but elderly scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong.
2. The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
3. Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
Charles Stross authors a series called “The Laundry Files”. The gist of the series is the Laundry is a branch of British secret service who use technology to perform magick. Members of the service use specially adapted smart phones instead of wands and staffs. His first book “The Atrocity Archives” is what actually got me interested in Arduino programming.
Yeah, that’s a funny conundrum. Of course it makes sense from a real-world perspective how the gods that are superheroes and the gods that are actively worshipped would be mutually exclusive categories — the alternative may not be *inherently* bad but it’s a delicate balancing act that most people would prefer to avoid — but from a diegetic perspective, of course it’d seem weird.
Hey! The gods nobody whorships have to make ends meet somehow!
Another weird thing would be that they know Gods are real, but there are still Atheists around
In a world where actual gods are walking around and everyone knows it the term atheist would probably changed to include “does not worship any god”, just like it was changed in our world to include “lacks belief in any god”. It just makes things easier.
It’s pretty straightforward an atheist will just deny that they are actually a god. Probably insist they are just powerful superheros from prehistory.
Many people that would be Atheists in reality, would just go by Antitheists instead, particularly the kind that does believe in gods but not in their worship.
It would probably be even more logical to be an Atheist.
“People claimed those guys were Gods, but they’re just super powerful aliens. At least we can prove those guys exist.”
Exactly. And it’s not only the ancient alien hypothesis, but e.g. some folks believe that Jesus was just an immensely psychically gifted guy.
Pterry has indulged on this. The gods there sometimes form a mob and attack the houses of atheist. Also Susan Sto Helit’s ability while working as a teachers and caregiver to actually beat up figures like the bogeyman, are explained away as psychological tricks to help the children get over theirs fear of is supposedly purely imaginary threats.
“As the novels progress, Susan proves to be quite good at handling small children, a skill that is attributed to her sensible and practical nature. This is reflected in her novel approach to children’s problems. When a child complains about a monster in the cupboard or under the bed, most parents would go to great lengths to carefully explain to the child that there is no monster. Susan, on the other hand, simply hands the child a suitable weapon with which to assault the monster, or, in the event of an actual monster, assaults it herself. Monsters from a wide area have come to dread the fireplace poker she uses for this task, although as word of Susan has quickly spread among the city’s resident monsters, she lately has only needed to deal with newcomers.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_Sto_Helit
In The Dresden Files, there’s this group of paladins called the Knights of the Cross, who each carry a sword with a nail from the Crucifixion embedded in the hilt, in order to fight fallen angels.
Sanya, the only remaining active member of the three the series started with, is an agnostic.
Waldo Butters, the first permanent replacement Knight, is Jewish.
Not to mention Larry Fowler.
His attempts to sue the protagonist multiple times for damage done to his electronics shop have become laughable at best, as his whole case depends on finding a judge who believes magic is real. Which he can’t.
Even Marvel Earth has skeptics.
Brainier heroes like Reed Richards and Tony Stark are willing to acknowledge that things like gods and magic MIGHT be real… Of course, since they count Dr. Strange and Thor as close friends and allies, you get the idea that they’re just too stubborn to admit there’s a part of the world that even they can’t explain.
I like the Discworld interpretation (paraphrased) of that “Once you start peddling with the occult, you start believing in fairies, and then in gods.” “But all those things EXIST.” “That don’t mean you should believe in ‘em. It only encourages them.”
Yeah, but they wouldn’t consider a “superhero god” to be a “god”.
Just an empowered alien long lived being who their un-enlightened ancestors once worshiped as “god”. Many of the super beings in this setting would be considered “gods” in an un-enlightened time. It depends on you interpretation of “god”.
A bunch of the gods in question basically act like Asstronomus. They’ve got superhuman powers which they mostly just use to indulge their whims.
When you’re worshipping, you probably prefer gods that are a bit more transcendental. Or at least, you worship them for their less tangible, but more useful, ability to make the crops grow, or whatever is supposed to be their special sphere of influence.
Maybe not everyone can learn magic, but you only hear about people who managed it?
Shitropolis also explicitly has an unusually high density of superpowers. The advanced technology may be part of that, with science superheroes who can make things that don’t actually work if anyone else builds them, or who understand concepts that are literally beyond the grasp of an ordinary human brain.
Odin is still worshipped Keith, he just doesn’t have that many followers.
Tbh I thought the third panel would be focusing on there being atheists around, rather than the major worshipped gods not being present.
But nice to see that there wasn’t any Nay-theism or flat-eart atheism being flung around.
Great. Now I am confused too…
From a Doylist perspective, the truth is that these superhero universes are dictated by their writers, most of whom seek to specifically keep Marvel and DC, et al, as artificially close to ‘real life’ as possible.
Hence advanced tech that is still so limited, a lack of repeatable artificial power methods so superhuman arms races aren’t an issue, and such. And of course no Superhero Jesus lest you offend a large portion of your reader base or churches/synagogues/mosques start suing.
Our heroes already saw how scary Big Religion can be in court…
OK, guys, the time for Super Holy Team has finally arrived.
Unsure if they are the good guys or the supervillains though.
Also science is the real magic. That’s why almost nobody understands how gadgets work and the guilds of engineers are so extremely powerful.
I mean: if everybody could understand it, it would not be magic, right? Well, exactly the same the other way around.
British science fiction writer Arthur C. Clarke formulated three adages that are known as Clarke’s three laws, of which the third law is the best known and most widely cited. They are part of his ideas in his extensive writings about the future. These so-called laws are:
1. When a distinguished but elderly scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong.
2. The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
3. Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
Phil Foglio, who writes Girl Genius, coined a counterpoint to your #3.
“Any sufficiently analyzed magic is indistinguishable from science!”
Charles Stross authors a series called “The Laundry Files”. The gist of the series is the Laundry is a branch of British secret service who use technology to perform magick. Members of the service use specially adapted smart phones instead of wands and staffs. His first book “The Atrocity Archives” is what actually got me interested in Arduino programming.
The gods who are worshipped in the mainstream don’t need the advertising that comes from the hero-gig